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Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
New release is a well integrated system, not a mere collection of parts.
I came to know SuSE some years ago as a Red Hat-like distribution that featured tighter component integration, internationalization and a modest emphasis on security (before it was vogue). Since then, it's been one I typically recommend to people, and I generally find they're pleased with it.
SuSE 8.0's default installation includes:
a SuSE firewall interface and "personal firewall"
KDE, with SuSE additions
lots of documentation, from both the LDP and SuSE
StarOffice 5.2 and other desktop tools
ReiserFS as the default filesystem
For all of these reasons, SuSE 8.0 represents an excellent choice for a typical Linux user, and especially for a new user.
I installed SuSE on two machines: a desktop machine I keep around for development and one of my laptops, which has taken over as a main machine of mine. The installation of this beta was preceded by warnings about beta software and lack of support, but of course, they're asking for feedback--fair enough. And off we were, with German bits here and there to confuse me.
The base installation includes a lot of software. This may not be what you want if you're a power user and like to keep it lean, but it's very handy for new users. One typical drawback is the confusion over all of the choices. Perhaps companies should start looking to install the "best of breed" software by default and leave the rest of it on the CDs. You can, of course, go with a customized installation.
I installed the system several times, testing the various options. None of the problems were the kinds of things you wouldn't find in another distribution installation and can be worked around, often through a manual installation.
The installation process is quite a marvel. SuSE seems to have really learned a lot from the process over the years, and they have implemented it very well. New users will find it quite easy to do, and power users will have many options open to them for adjusting their settings.
If the system autodetects a Windows partition, it will shrink it to a reasonable size and install Linux after that. The choice of ReiserFS is also very sensible. It's a stable filesystem and can boot quickly, all things that would matter to anyone, new users especially.
The installation process is well hidden from users. A system of autodetection finds hardware and makes choices about installation that would suit a typical user. Making changes is also quite easy.
Once installed, the system is nicely laid out. The integration of KDE and SuSE elements is user friendly, configuration through the various Yast2 utilities is intuitive and documentation is well placed and handy.
SuSE 8.0b3 is based on the Linux 2.4.18 kernel, KDE3 and XFree86 4. While KDE3 is still prerelease in this edition, it was rather stable and easy to use. This was my first foray into some of the newer features that SuSE is using, and I found I was able to get around quickly and catch up to speed with ease.
The base system is pretty large, over 1GB. This isn't a big deal in terms of what a typical system disk can do these days, but should be noted if you're hoping for a svelte installation. You'll find a lot to do as you explore that 1GB.
I was pretty overwhelmed, frankly, by all of the installed options on my desktop. While some things were easy to navigate, some were not--just too many options to sift through. It may be worthwhile to trim down your account's desktop settings to cover only things you will actually use. It's also advisable to trim out administration stuff from regular users, which can help keep down the clutter.
KDE is an easy to use and intuitive desktop environment. The main applications, namely web, office and games, were all well represented.
Star Office 5.2 is included in the default installation, so it's easy to handle other document formats sent to you, edit them and send them back. Simply click the desktop icon, set up Star Office, and you're ready to go.
The default browser is Konquerer, not the familiar Netscape. Having gone through a lot of development and testing, it's become very robust and easy to use. In fact, plenty of people who don't use KDE use Konquerer! Mail is also handled through a KDE application, KMail, which should be pretty intuitive for most e-mail users.
Desktop and system customization were also simple--not only the typical KDE customization, but SuSE has a good number of GUI tools to help configure the system.
New users should find the SuSE desktop to be what they're looking for. Applications, navigation and customization are all simple. The interface borrows heavily from Windows and other GUIs, including Apple's OS X, bringing together an altogether intuitive desktop.
Also, one of SuSE's biggest strengths is its internationalization. SuSE supports many languages, including German, English (both UK and US versions) Spanish and many more. Similarly, it supports the Intel x86, IBM PPC, Compaq Alpha and Sun Sparc processors--truly multiflavored!
______________________
- Fun with ethtool
- Parallel Programming with NVIDIA CUDA
- 100% disappointed with the decision to go all digital.
- Readers' Choice Awards 2011
- Linux-Based X Terminals with XDMCP
- Validate an E-Mail Address with PHP, the Right Way
- You Need A Budget
- The Linux powered LAN Gaming House
- Why Python?
- Python for Android
- Sure the best distro is
1 hour 7 min ago - BeOS was the best
3 hours 51 min ago - I use Wireshark on a daily
8 hours 21 min ago - buena información
13 hours 28 min ago - One important "bucket" that I didn't note (désolé si qqun deja d
14 hours 29 min ago - Gnome3 is such a POS. No one
23 hours 56 min ago - Gnome 3 is the biggest POS
1 day 7 min ago - I didn't knew this thing by
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Comments
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
The DVD of 8.0 Pro wont work with some Pioneer drives - Suse UK have told me they dont know why BUT are sending a replacement to see _if_ its just that particular DVD.
OK so I will wait to try Suse again. I think last install was 7.3 and it seeemed solid - not as twitchy as Drake . . .
I wish though that everyone would stop bitchin about distros, with all the different kit / experiences we are all going to have _some_ probs. I just installed RH72 as a server for a company - I had more problems getting Win2k and the other 98 clients to behave than I did with Linux !!! United we will stand . . . .
SuSE
Long time ago I
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
I have worked on SUSE 7.2 and I have decided I will remain loyal to Windows 2000 and XP when the service pack is released.
As and when until SUSE/REDHAT or which ever distro one cares to use have got their act together and provide proper software installers, drivers for all the devices in the world (yes Windows does!) etc I will consider switching to linux and move the 43,000 workstations that are currently running windows 2000 Pro.
Thanks
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
I agree on the software installation; it can be a pain in the ass!
RPM's are easy,Tar.gz can be bothersome and clumsy.
If Linux (any distribution) can get this problem sorted, then a great future lies ahead.
The problem in Windows, is clutter, so many little parts of a de-installed program stay behind, it slows the system down, even in XP. Let alone the registry problems...
No, linux has the future, but software installation needs to be more straightforward!
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
If you can tell SuSE or RedHat that you can promise 43,000 installs of their product, I'm sure they got business-sense enough to do a lot to help you with what-ever problem you may have.
As some of the other comments in this thread state, W2K and other MS-product aren't without problems - we are just so use to deal with them.
I'm quite tired of installing patches on my W2K mashines...
S
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
Well with as much money as MS has, Windows should be much better than Linux. It isn't. It's only easier to get started. Actually RedHat 7.2 found all my hardware whereas Windows could not find my modem -USRobotics-,NIC -Netgear-,Sound Card -SBLive-. I had to manually install them all. And when I removed my modem, Win2k lost my Soundcard.?? And it refuses to see it again. No problems on RH. They are dual booted on the same box. Considering its resources, Linux is amazing. You shouldn't expect changes in the industry to get incorporated quickly in linux. After all, Linux gets little support from the people that MADE Microsoft. Developers.
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
Wrong. Windows doesn't provide the drivers for many hardware items, much less than for all of them. Usually you have to either use a CD from the hardware manufacturer or download the driver from somewhere. I would guess that for most users, installing Windows would be more of a pain than installing Suse.
scott
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
Microsoft hides the source code, so you can't be sure to get the right driver for the right hardware.
Microsoft doesn't provide many drivers, especially in XP, older hardware isn't sometimes supported!
So I agry with Anonymous.
Sometimes Windows s*cks, sometimes Linux s*cks!
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
Suse still misses the mark for many people who are used to the ease of use of Windows. Why can nobody arrange the use of internal modems easily, or program a system like the Windows Installer. If a Windows user could migrate to Linux using his PCI modem, and without using a command shell, many more would do so. There are 3 CD's with Suse 8.0 but there is no reference to the contents, or the usage of the third CD anywhere in the manuals or the installation procedure.
Rogleale
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: WinModems et al
Once more, with feeling: the problem comes from the WinModems, not Linux.
WinModems (aka PCI modems) are reduced-part count interface cards that rely on
software drivers to emulate hardware functions regularly used on "real" modems.
The modem manufacturers have not been cooperative in sharing hardware specifications
with the Linux community, otherwise knowledgable Linux driver programmers would
have written appropriate drivers years ago. Rumour has it that a certain powerful software company will certify a WinModem as OK for use only if the hardware specs are kept secret.
Solution: get a real modem. I bought a USR Courier at a computer fair for $75, it works great.
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: WinModems et al
unexceptable, my Intel chipset Ambient modem is now over one year late in giving me the promised linux driver for kernal 2.4.
no God damned way I'm buying a 75-buck modem to do what my 15-buck modem does right now under windows...................and so I wait............and wait........................and wait...................for Intel's promised driver.............16 months later I'm still waiting.
Linux simply MUST address this problem. Hardware modems are like flushing money down your toilet. For that kind of money buy a damned cable/ADSL modem.
Support 15-buck winmodems......enough already......not support.........no linux!
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: WinModems et al
Back in the early 90's, modem manufacturers tried
to sell software based modems (this is DOS and WIN 3.1, etc.), and they were effectively stopped, because the public didn't buy enough of them, and,
because the writers of communications software wouldn't support them.
Then Pentiums happened, and they tried again. You think software modems are great? Well, they are robbing your CPU of time, and often are not very freindly to the people who have to run ISP's because they have incompatibilities with protocols
in some cases.
The reason Linux doesn't support them in general
is because the manufacturer's usually don't allow
developers to know how to code for them. Though
there are several initiatives to try and code, with or without help (See www.tldp.org for HowTo's including help for softmodems).
Basically, you are complaining to the wrong people.
Have a good day.
Diskette installation
Try to let a 6-month linux novice perform a diskette installation (pretending the cd-rom installation mode doesn't work.)
The information on that point is scarce, self-contradictory (they talk of accomp. boot diskettes and somewhere else claim they don't exist)
They write you select a directory for rawrite, while the program asks for .img files.
No .img files exists on the cd-roms.
They state an image directory is on CD1 while it's on CD2. No .img files is in this dir.
As I see it, SuSE8 is a rush job, uncoordinated, incomplete and lacking in user friendliness.
Re: Diskette installation
Why would you want to do a diskette installation? Diskette is slow, clumsy and obsolete.
I really can not blame SuSE for spending only little bit of effort on diskette installation.
Re: Diskette installation
I don't even know what it is. However if I had a computer without a cdrom or DVD drive than I would jsut buy a new one. WHo in the hell only has a floppy drive. SUSE included both DVD and cdroms i think taht's enough.
Re: Diskette installation
What about computers too small to have CD-ROM drives? Or what if you don't have a burner so you can't get the ISO image to a CD anyway?
Re: Diskette installation
Yep, and some pc's simply won't boot from the cd-drive. It's as simple as that.
Re: Diskette installation
for what its worth as a "newbie" myself : I had to install linux on a laptop with only a usb external cd rom and a floppy to go on. The .img's where a salvation and a little net research was requiredt to learn the 'dd' command to make the floppies from the iso. That pcmcia.img boot floppy with some drivers was the magic pill. Anyway, newbies with some curiosity can certainly handle the quirks!
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
I started my Linux life with SuSE and have since switched to RedHat. SuSE was always stable and pretty intuitive. Their configuration tools are very nice. Much nicer than RedHat. My RedHat box freezes randomly and I haven't been able to pinpoint the problem so I may just go with another distro. Might be time to try Mandrake or go back to SuSE. I would recomment SuSE to newbies as I was a newbie who first tried SuSE. What I'd really like to see is a review of distros done by newbies. Bring in people who have no Linux experience and see how easy it is for them to install SuSE or RedHat or Mandrake. That kind of feedback is very important in the evolution of Linux
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
Suse may be a lot of fun for others but for me it was not anything like fun. I spent an entire weekend trying to get the stupid thing installed before realizing there was a problem with the make of the modem card. It sounds so easy to install this thing but it is not if you are a normal Windows user. Windows I know and can find my way about just fine. I can use dos when I have to but this Suse thing is a nightmare. First thing I noticed was there is no way to explain how one goes about this at all. 1, 2, 3 says the installation directions but it was nothing like that. More like 100, 200, 300 and stop. Nowhere does it even tell one how to open a file or even mount a drive . I suppose you have to have something like knowledge before you wish to attempt loading this thing. 60 days or maybe it was 90 days of support. First I had to redo windows and get back up so I could get my work done. then I had to purchase a new modem. Maybe when I finally get this thing loaded and running I will know what it is I am supposed to ask the support people. Of course that is if it is something covered. Lot's of stuff is not covered. What I wanted was something simple. Plug it in, click buttons to design my layout and defaults and spend the next two or three weeks learning how to operate it. I couldn't even open or load one of the files let alone try to accomplish anything. There are no mentions I am aware of, about what is on the other CDs. It took two to load the program, and then it just stops. Nothing asks for the next CD or even tells one how to go about finding out about them. I still don't know what is on those CDs. Linux I am willing to give another chance although I have tried two installations of different distros and found them awful. I don't like the windows world very much but what I have found of Linux makes me think it has been designed by a bunch of high schoolers (and it may have) with incomplete programs, half ideas, "I'm going to finish this" work and silly file names that only a child could love. What ever happened to file names that had some relationship to the function of the file. I think having the ability to program is one thing and the ability to submit a finished and polished program is something else. I, for one, would like a bit more of the polished and finished product and a little less of the raw but something for everyone pile I think Suse is. Hey, I'll try it again......and again...and again...cause I dislike windows. I'll just have to keep Bill's creation aboard to get the work done with!!
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
I won't claim to have a cystal ball into your machine, but all the "random" recent freezes that I have had have been due to hardware. Most recently, poor quality memory has been the largest problem. Athlon anything seems hightly sensitive to less that stellar quality memory.
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
I checked the memory with memtest86 and got no errors. I don't have the money to replace 512 MB of DDR right now. I have noticed that the hard drive winds up when it crashes and doesn't really wind down again. I am wondering it is related to the hard drive. I have Win2k on a seperate drive and haven't noticed any errors. Which if it is a hard drive problem I wouldn't. It is a brand new Samsung 60GB drive tho. I'd be disappointed if it were bad. The whole system is new so theoretically hardware should be good.
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
I have an Athlon system with 512 MB of DDR. I'm currently running Win2000, Mandrake 8.2 and Libranet 2.0. All of them are fine. But I like the Libranet distro the best. It's a Debian based distro and very easy to upgrade with the well-known apt-get tool. I have never tried SuSE. So I cannot comment on that. Mandrake 8.2 rpmdrake (I believe) is very nice too.
Re: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review-problems w/ SuSE 7.3
My experience with SuSE 7.3 causes me to recommend the distro as the 'Cadillac' of Linux. The 'sheer mass' of applications provided and advanced partition options such as REISERFS and LVM (Logical Volume Manager) I think support that title.
In v7.3 however, the installation on a 2-disk system (one =NT) blew its mind when the second disk was secondary slave. I found YAST rather clumsy and sometimes in conflict with command-line options. After my unsuccesful attempt to rebuild a 'crash' (I am an amateur), with Reiserfs and especially the LVM, I successfully installed the latest Mandrake distro and am very happy (although I miss my LVM).
I think all reviews should include this installation test (multiple disks with slave buses).
GRUB rules!
Re: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review-problems w/ SuSE 7.3
Does SuSE 8.0 support LVM?
In that case, does that mean that I can have software RAID in Windows2k, and still be able to boot SuSE 8.0 ??
In that case, it would be awesome!
Re: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review-problems w/ SuSE 7.3
Yes SuSE 8.0 support LVM and software RAID like Windows 2000.
LVM and software RAID is supported also in SuSE 7.3.
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
SUSE is pretty good. And the online update feature is great. But the firewalls need work. One desktop says that the personal firewall is not active (due to the iptables firewall also installed) and the iptables firewall always indicates failure at step 2 of 3 on bootup. Yet when I check the runlevel config tool, it indicates that the iptables firewall is running. So is it, or isn't it?
On my server running apache, the iptables firewall also fails at step 2 of 3 on bootup. When I check the runlevel config tool, it indicates that the iptables firewall is NOT running. Trying to start it up with this tool results in an error message. So I have Apache running, serving a website, and no firewall.
>newbie who doesn't know if his firewall is running on workstation, and running apache naked on server.
SuSE is the Best Linux distribution !!!!
I have got two machine with SuSE
one with 7.1 annother with 7.3
on both have got runnign SAMBA, Apache, DNS, sendmail, pop3 and SuSEfirewall on 7.1 and SuSEfirewall2 on 7.3
I haven't nay problem with my SuSE
any server rorek corectly and SuSEfirewall work prefectly
i don't know what is your problem but I'm sure the problem is not in firewall /you hat to use SuSEfirewall2 not SuSefirewall or presonalfirewall/
you may configure on hand or by YAST2
if you configuretion is corect firewall will work without any problem.
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
SUSE is very good. I also don't see the need to have KDE 2.2.2 when there is KDE 3. SUSE also has a better installation than Mandrake and the way KDE looks by default looks better than in Mandrake. SUSE's administration/yast tools are also beter. MAny of Mandrake's Frake tools are too buggy. I suggest you buy SUSE 8 before suggesting anything.
If anybody wants to try Mandrake 8.2 before SUSE 8 here is a speedy server:
ftp://ftp.sunet.se/pub/Linux/distributions/mandrake/iso/
If anybody wants to try SUSE without actually installing it get SUSE LIVE 7.3. It was rleased about 7 months ago. IT boots from the CD and it takes much less than 100 mb. THe installation is very simple no partitioning or anything. I think it only works on FAT though.
Download it here: http://www.linuxiso.org/download.php/328/liveeval-7.3.iso
Thanks
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
There is also a liveeval-8.0! And installing from the ftp is as easy as downloading an ISO and you dont have to store or burn anything, provided you got the connection of course.
If you relly like it you can always buy the box that way U invest in future realeses of your favorite dist;)
Now if I could just get my 8.0 box from my dealer....
Re: Zee Germans and Zee Penguins: SuSE 8.0 beta 3 Review
Where is the link to the liveeval of SuSE8.0.
Please post the link.
How about comparing to a real desktop distro?
While the review covers the basics, it would be nice to see a review that compares some of the features we would expect after having used something like Mandrake 8.2 (Redhat really shouldn't be considered a desktop distro):
-What is used for package management? Rumours have it that SuSE will be using apt/rpm in 8.0. Is there a nice graphical interface (ala rpmdrake) that can install software while resolving dependencies?
-How good is hardware support? Are scanners etc. now configured out the box (like on Mandrake 8.2). How about TV tuners?
-KDE2 compatability? Does SuSE ship with KDE 2 also, or does it at least provide the libs for KDE2 so that I can run pre-KDE3.0 programs? (Mandrake 8.2 ships with KDE2.2.2, but KDE 3.0 RPMs that will work alongside KDE2.2.2 are available on the KDE mirrors).
-Mandrake is specifically set up so that users have a consistent menu system (borrowed from Debian) across all the window managers /desktops (I think 11 in total). Does SuSE provide this?
-How easy is it to set up internet connection sharing (Mandrake's is trivial, any windows user would be able to do it).
-Does it come with OpenOffice or Star Office 6.0 (the download version of Mandrake comes with OpenOffice 641c, the commercial versions come with StarOffice6.0). Star Office 5.2 is a bit long in the tooth!
Distro reviews really need to have info on the CURRENT release of the competition, this article doesn't really provide much enlightening to anyone who is choosing a desktop linux distro. Before spending money on SuSE (or waiting for them to release downloadable ISOs), I would suggest trying Mandrake, and if you really need a .0 release of KDE3 (not really suggested for casual users), get the Mandrake RPMs from the KDE mirrors.
Re: How about comparing to a real desktop distro?
Sure. I'm a long time LINUX user, 9 years and counting, and have used ecery imaginable distro and of late, have been a mostly Mandrake user for my desktop. Previous desktop favorite was Caldera. I'm trying to upgrade my system at home from its current Mandrake 7.2 to something newer and I'm frankly disgusted with the new releases. I went through the Mandrake 8.0/.1/.2 and am actually sending this email from Mandrake 8.2 (Yes, I paid my money and joined the club!). I'm dumping Mandrake 8.2 because of the bugs. The StarOffice 6.0 crashes all over the place, although OpenOffice works better. The StarOffice 5.2 hangs all the time as does Netscape 6.2.2. And just try to burn a damn CD! Forget it. Sure, I can handcraft my system, and sire my own user community, but without question Mandrake 8.2 is worse than 7.2 so I'm dumping it. Now to SuSE 7.3 - I haven't installed SuSE 8.0 yet. SuSE 7.3 runs everything its supposed to. Great distro. Less aesthetically pleasing than Mandrake, but solid as a rock. Nothing crashes or hangs on it. Also couldn't burn a CD there without some handcrafting. I'm proficient with X-CDROAST, gcombust, eroaster (eClipt), others..., but none of them worked out of the box. In fact, since I don't have a SCSI disk drive on my system, only a SCSI Scanner and DAT/Media Changer, the SCSI Controller drivers are not loaded by the OS, I had to manually configure the system to do that.
Frankly, I see LINUX going backwards. Shame, shame, shame. I am a LINUX bigot and it really dissappoints me.
Hey, SuSE and Mandrake - do some bloody QA!
Gary.
Re: can not do dual boot
I have win2k in my desktop. After installed SuSE8.0 which I bought from CompUSA, I can only start SuSE, and every time when I tried to start win2k, an error message appears: io.sys missing or bad. SuSE only supports itself?
Re: can not do dual boot
i have WinXp and SuSE 8.0 on one box, Win200 and SuSE 8.0 on the other. they dual boot fine. you either did not partition correctly or don't know how to set up your boot manager correctly. get someone who knows what they are doing to set it up for you correctly before making any false claims. I also have WinXp and SuSE 8.0 on my laptop (a Compaq Presario 1700. my modem works, my lan works, my sound works, everything works. SuSE is the Distro to beat in my opinion
Re: can not do dual boot
I also have win2k and bought SUSE 8.0 from CompUSA. It worked correctly and I can dual boot wilthout any problems. Do you have a Fat32 particianed disk. NTFS willnot work. To make my installation more complex I am installing on a notebook Dell Inspiron 8000 with a Geforce2 Go graphics card. It worked great. The only problem I found was when I went to SUSE site for an auto update. Their server told me that certain packages were not installed but I accepted the auto install and all came out fine.
Re: can not do dual boot
Uhhh is it a NTFS file system or Fat32...... I think you might have NTFS check and see
Re: How about comparing to a real desktop distro?
"-How good is hardware support? Are scanners etc. now configured out the box (like on Mandrake 8.2)."
My Epson 1640SU was unusable in Mandrake 8.2, so much for the "configured out of the box" claim.
"-Mandrake is specifically set up so that users have a consistent menu system (borrowed from Debian) across all the window managers /desktops (I think 11 in total)."
The menu system in Mandrake is a joke and hardly consistent. When I installed Crossover and Hancom Office the menu editions were anything but consistent if you could find the menu additions at all.
The only thing Mandrake 8.2 did right was setting up my printer an Epson Stylus C80.
Additionally all of the cd burning packages were broken except for X-CD-Roast in Mandrake 8.2.
I tried Mandrake 8.2 and having a non-working scsi scanner and broken cd-burning programs did not appeal to me. I have found the beta of RedHat 7.3 much more usable then Mandrake 8.2.
Re: How about comparing to a real desktop distro?
Agreed. My experience with Mandrake 8.2 was exactly the same as yours. I've used (and use) every distro available and since 7.2 Mandrake has gone steadily backwards. SuSE has a ways to go to catch up for user-friendliness, but judging by SuSE 7.3 they'll soon overtake Mandrake.
Too bad - the LINUX distros are doing less and less QA and undoing all the ground that LINUX has gained in the last three years against the "other" desktop operating system.
My 2c worth.
G.
Re: How about comparing to a real desktop distro?
Please, no version of Mandrake has yet to stand up to SuSE Pro and 8.2 doesn't figure to be any different!
Re: How about comparing to a real desktop distro?
You sound like a promo for Mandrake. It has its problems too. I've been trying for months to install 8.0 and have had nothing but problems. I still don't have a functional installation and Mandrake Expert has been useless.
Why I am not buying Mandrake
I'm considering buying a shrinkwrap distribution
rather tnan burning the CDs. SUSE and Red Hat list
the contents of each version on their web sites.
Mandrake does not. Guess which company is not on
my short list.
Re: How about comparing to a real desktop distro?
You're not very specific about your problems. I suggest you try 8.2 as it is a great deal easier than 8.0 (not one of my favorites). If you clearly describe your complaints they are easier to address.
Re: How about comparing to a real desktop distro?
Before spending money on SuSE (or waiting for them to release downloadable ISOs), I would suggest trying Mandrake, and if you really need a .0 release of KDE3 (not really suggested for casual users), get the Mandrake RPMs from the KDE mirrors.
Yuk!!!! There needs to be a better package system. I like FreeBSD ports collection, but damn, I went through at least 3 different sets of RPMS before my KDE 3 worked 100% on Mandrake 8.2 (yet, KDE 3 RC2, worked without a hitch on 8.1 -shrug-)
Re: How about comparing to a real desktop distro?
There will be probably no downloadable ISOs, but if downloading over 5 CDs is an option for you, the fine working ftp installation is definitly recommended.
Mandrak is like Windows how can copare with SuSE????
Did you hear about kderpm, xrpm gnoprm ????
or command line rpm wha you want more?
or you don't konw how you may install you favourite rpm GUI program if it is not in distribution??
Yes SuSE support TV Card. You may read about this if you want
SuSE provide also many window managers /desktops
What you say about stability and bugs?
I work with SuSE many years and I didin't yet crash my desktop . SuSE is more stability and bugfixed than Mandrake, Madrake is more bugable
sorry but that's is true
madrka is for M$ fans ;-)
Re: Mandrak is like Windows how can copare with SuSE????
Well, I have tried SuSE 7.3 after switching for years between
RedHat and Mandrake. I'm back to Mandrake.
The reason: the two application I use all the time for writing
papers (I work in a university), Xemacs and XFig are buggy as
hell in SuSE 7.3. XEmacs kept crashing on me whenever
it had to deal with a TeX file included in another TeX file.
XFig does not crash, but it does not seem to know how to change
fonts/font sizes -- the font selection is broken.
True, SuSE looks very nice, but I actually USE linux on my
desctop, not just stare at it.
Go Mandrake!
SUSE, Mandrake comparison
SUSE:
I tried MAndrake 8.2 right before getting suse 8 and it looked like a rushed job. THe installation was nowhere near as good as SUSE 8's which was absolutely fabulous and looked very very nice and proffesional. With SUSE it really was like they said, onlya couple of clicks It correctly configured alll of my hardware. I even added a new optical mouse and it autoamtically told me it detected it and configured it jsut like windows. The YAST tools are also fantastic. They will let you easily do everything you want (some things not even the windows control pannel has) and look fantastic too. I created a new user in only 2 miniutes (in mandrake the new user I created din't even show up) Everything in SUSE looks and works great. ( I think that the bootup screen and desktop background looked better in 7.3 though.
SUSE-MANDRAKE COMPARISON
Mandrake was also good. It configured most of my hardware correctly but the installation wasn't as easy and looked un-proffesional. SUSE's looked much better. Even better than XP's because it looked great from the beggining in XP upgrade the first 5 miniutes when you start it tell it to format find the previous version of windows it looks horrible. The drake tools in Mandrake are also quite buggy and they aren't all integrated well like in YAST (Yet Another Setup TOol). In SUSE I just click YAST and I can easily acess all of the tools. THe tools are even in the KDE control center. In fact YAST is very simmilar to the control center in windows except taht it has a completely different interface and the way things are layed out. Mandrake's support was medicore but didn't impress me much. SUSE however included 4 books that covered everything. It even covered gimp, kooka, staroffice, and other programs. I was very impressed with how grat the manuals were. SUSE also had the best looking KDE. ALso as far as perormance and stability goes I don't know why but SUSE did a lot ebtter in both. It booted faster, KDE booted and worked a lot faster and it also hasn't completely crashed yet. (it was only 1 time but CTRL backspace fixed it) while in Mandrake I think I crashed 5 times at the very least.
(sorry about my grammar and spelling Im from Romania but moved to CA)
SUSE, Mandrake comparison
SUESE:
I tried MAndrake 8.2 right before getting suse 8 and it looked like a rushed job. THe installation was nowhere near as good as SUSE 8's which was absolutely fabulous and looked very very nice and proffesional. With SUSE it really was like they said, onlya couple of clicks It correctly configured alll of my hardware. I even added a new optical mouse and it autoamtically told me it detected it and configured it jsut like windows. The YAST tools are also fantastic. They will let you easily do everything you want (some things not even the windows control pannel has) and look fantastic too. I created a new user in only 2 miniutes (in mandrake the new user I created din't even show up) Everything in SUSE looks and works great. ( I think that the bootup screen and desktop background looked better in 7.3 though.
SUSE-MANDRAKE COMPARISON
Mandrake was also good. It configured most of my hardware correctly but the installation wasn't as easy and looked un-proffesional. SUSE's looked much better. Even better than XP's because it looked great from the beggining in XP upgrade the first 5 miniutes when you start it tell it to format find the previous version of windows it looks horrible. The drake tools in Mandrake are also quite buggy and they aren't all integrated well like in YAST (Yet Another Setup TOol). In SUSE I just click YAST and I can easily acess all of the tools. THe tools are even in the KDE control center. In fact YAST is very simmilar to the control center in windows except taht it has a completely different interface and the way things are layed out. Mandrake's support was medicore but didn't impress me much. SUSE however included 4 books that covered everything. It even covered gimp, kooka, staroffice, and other programs. I was very impressed with how grat the manuals were. SUSE also had the best looking KDE. ALso as far as perormance and stability goes I don't know why but SUSE did a lot ebtter in both. It booted faster, KDE booted and worked a lot faster and it also hasn't completely crashed yet. (it was only 1 time but CTRL backspace fixed it) while in Mandrake I think I crashed 5 times at the very least.
(sorry about my grammar and spelling Im from Romania but moved to CA)
Re: Mandrak is like Windows how can copare with SuSE????
I'm certainly no M$ fan, but I've used both SuSE and Mandrake in the past (I'm currently running MDK 8.2 on all my systems).From the sounds of this review, Mandrake and SuSE are both excellent in their current versions. I've not found MDK to be buggy at all, the only problem I had with it was that it set the default DPI wrongly for my printer, which was easily corrected through the printer config tool.I say good luck to both companies, they are putting out some excellent packages !!